Cardiologist Peter McCullough told Joe Rogan that Anthony Fauci’s own emails and texts show the scientists behind the foundational “natural origin” paper knew COVID came out of a lab. McCullough called the paper a “cover-up manuscript,” turning a familiar pandemic debate into an accusation of deliberate deception. During a conversation with Rogan, his first in about five years, McCullough also described a Texas hospital case involving monoclonal antibodies, a pastor, and a decision that ended with the pastor’s death.
McCullough, the former Baylor Medical bigwig and current Wellness Company chief scientific officer, revisited the virus origin story. He said Peter Daszak’s EcoHealth Alliance brokered coronavirus research in Wuhan that was funded by Fauci’s NIAID. When the World Health Organization went to investigate, former Trump task force member Brett Giroir offered independent American scientists, but McCullough said the WHO declined and instead told Giroir, “We’ll take Peter Daszak.”
McCullough said Daszak went to Wuhan, looked around, and declared the virus “didn’t come from the lab.” He added, “This all happened under the watch of people.” That is a serious accusation, and it puts the credibility of the official origin narrative directly in the crosshairs.
McCullough then discussed the Nature Medicine paper by Kristian Andersen and four co-authors, which concluded that laboratory manipulation of a related coronavirus was improbable. “Do you know that there were 12 papers written? It looks like Fauci commissioned the first one with Jeremy Farrar, who was at the Wellcome Trust at the time, and with Peter Daszak,” he said. McCullough continued, “In Fauci’s emails and texts, they all knew it came out of the lab. That was a cover-up manuscript.” He also said, “there were 12 more manuscripts published to this day that haven’t been retracted that say, well, it came out of the lab.”
Internal Slack messages between the paper’s authors, revealed by Sen. Rand Paul, added another layer to the dispute. According to those messages, Andersen privately put the odds of a lab origin at about 30 percent. Eddie Holmes put them at 20 percent at first and later 10 percent, even as the published paper sounded far more confident. The paperwork, apparently, had more certainty than the people writing it.
About an hour into the conversation, Rogan asked why monoclonal antibodies were so difficult to obtain. McCullough said he had used them “hundreds of times” and recalled a case just south of Dallas involving a pastor and his wife. “They give her monoclonal antibodies and say, you know, you’re well enough. You go home, take care of your five kids. They look at him. He’s a little heavier guy. They said, oh, you’re too sick. We’re admitting you. They don’t give him monoclonal antibodies and he dies,” McCullough said. “It can’t be any more clear.”
Rogan asked what the reasoning could have been. McCullough answered, “That wasn’t the way it was tested in clinical trials. It was only tested in outpatients.” The FDA authorization covered mild-to-moderate COVID in people who were not hospitalized. The agency said a benefit had not been shown in hospitalized patients and warned that the drug might be associated with worse outcomes for those needing high-flow oxygen or ventilation.
McCullough called that “clinical judgment” and said he would have given the drugs to everyone. “When my patients were anywhere close to the ER, I made sure that they got these monoclonal antibodies. I held them up in the ER. I said, listen, you’re not going into the hospital until you get monoclonal antibodies.” Denying them, he said, “tells you something about what this pandemic was really about.” Rogan offered his own theory: “What I had heard was they wanted to limit the use of monoclonal antibodies because they felt that it contributed to vaccine hesitancy.”
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